#456 — American Fascism
In this episode of Making Sense, Sam Harris and Jonathan Rauch examine the distinctions between fascism and patrimonialism in modern democracy. They explore how patrimonialism manifests when leaders treat the state as personal property, discussing how this differs from fascism's ultranationalist ideology and rejection of pluralism. The conversation includes an analysis of these concepts in relation to the Trump administration's governance approach and actions.
Rauch identifies specific properties of fascism present in recent American politics, while both speakers consider the implications of using the term "fascist" to describe current political movements. The discussion weighs the challenges of applying such terminology to contemporary politics, even as they examine how certain behaviors and patterns align with historical definitions of fascism and threaten democratic institutions.
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1-Page Summary
Defining and Distinguishing Fascism vs. Patrimonialism
In their discussion, Jonathan Rauch and Sam Harris explore the key differences between fascism and patrimonialism, two distinct political phenomena affecting modern democracy.
Understanding Patrimonialism
Jonathan Rauch explains that patrimonialism occurs when a leader treats the state as personal property, essentially running it like a family business. Under this system, leaders typically dismantle bureaucratic structures and replace qualified officials with loyal supporters, regardless of their competence. Harris notes that this accurately describes Trump's approach to governance, where he viewed American institutions as extensions of his personal property. While this leads to corruption and institutional decay, Rauch emphasizes that patrimonialism isn't necessarily ideological or expansionist.
The Nature of Fascism
Rauch and Harris characterize fascism as an ultranationalist, anti-liberal ideology focused on national rebirth. Unlike patrimonialism, fascism actively rejects pluralism and treats opposition as enemies that must be eliminated.
Evaluating the Trump Administration Through Fascism
Rauch identifies 18 properties of fascism present in the Trump administration's actions. He points out how the administration's tactics, including trolling and extreme insults, created an environment where traditional liberal discourse struggled to compete. The administration's tendency to glorify violence against peaceful protesters and its efforts to delegitimize the 2020 election align with fascist behavior patterns.
Dangers of Labeling Current Politics As "Fascist"
While Harris argues that calling Trump and his enablers fascist has become unavoidable due to their actions threatening liberal democracy, both speakers acknowledge the complexity of using such terminology. They suggest that while Trump's GOP hasn't achieved full-fledged fascism, the term accurately describes the concerning direction of their political trajectory.
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Clarifications
- Patrimonialism is a form of governance where political authority is treated as personal property by the ruler. It often involves nepotism and favoritism, with power concentrated in the hands of a leader and their close associates. This system undermines formal institutions and legal-rational authority, replacing them with personal loyalty. It contrasts with bureaucratic governance, which relies on rules and merit-based appointments.
- Patrimonialism centers on a leader treating the state as personal property, focusing on loyalty over ideology or national goals. Fascism is an ideological movement emphasizing ultranationalism, unity through suppression of opposition, and a vision of national rebirth. Patrimonialism often leads to corruption and weakened institutions, while fascism seeks to reshape society and politics through aggressive, exclusionary means. Thus, patrimonialism is about personal control, whereas fascism is about ideological dominance.
- Ultranationalism is an extreme form of nationalism that promotes the interests of one nation above all others, often leading to exclusion or hostility toward outsiders. Anti-liberal ideology opposes liberal principles like individual rights, democracy, and pluralism, favoring centralized control and uniformity. Together, these ideas reject diversity and democratic freedoms in favor of a dominant national identity and authoritarian rule. This combination often fuels aggressive policies and suppresses dissent.
- "National rebirth" in fascism refers to the idea of restoring a nation's former greatness after a period of perceived decline or weakness. It often involves promoting a unified national identity and rejecting values seen as weakening the country. This concept justifies radical changes and authoritarian rule to achieve renewal. It appeals to emotions like pride and nostalgia to mobilize support.
- Rejecting pluralism means refusing to accept diverse political views or groups within society. It undermines democratic principles by denying legitimacy to differing opinions. Treating opposition as enemies leads to hostility, suppression, or violence against dissenters. This behavior erodes open debate and democratic governance.
- Jonathan Rauch's 18 properties of fascism are a set of characteristics that help identify fascist movements or regimes. They include traits like cult of tradition, rejection of modernism, fear of difference, appeal to a frustrated middle class, obsession with a plot, and disdain for intellectuals. These properties also cover aspects such as obsession with crime and punishment, controlling the media, and promoting a paramilitary style. Rauch uses these to analyze political behavior and rhetoric that align with fascist tendencies.
- "Trolling and extreme insults" in politics involve deliberately provoking opponents and the public to create chaos and dominate media attention. These tactics undermine rational debate by shifting focus to emotional reactions and conflict. They can intimidate critics and polarize society, weakening democratic discourse. Such strategies often exploit social media's rapid spread of sensational content.
- Glorifying violence against peaceful protesters means praising or encouraging harm toward individuals exercising their right to nonviolent demonstration. This undermines democratic principles like free speech and assembly. It can intimidate citizens, suppress dissent, and escalate social conflict. Such behavior signals authoritarian tendencies by rejecting pluralism and peaceful opposition.
- "Delegitimizing the 2020 election" means casting doubt on the fairness and validity of the election results without credible evidence. This undermines public trust in democratic processes and institutions. It can lead to political instability and weaken the peaceful transfer of power. Such actions often involve spreading false claims of fraud or misconduct.
- Labeling a political group as "fascist" is complex because the term carries strong historical and emotional weight tied to extreme violence and totalitarian regimes. It can oversimplify nuanced political realities and alienate potential allies by provoking defensive reactions. Misuse of the term risks diluting its meaning, making it harder to identify genuine fascist threats. Additionally, political opponents may weaponize the label to discredit each other unfairly.
- "Full-fledged fascism" means a political system fully controlled by fascist ideology, with complete suppression of opposition and total state control. "Fascist tendencies" refer to behaviors or policies that resemble fascism but do not yet constitute a complete fascist regime. These tendencies might include authoritarian actions, nationalism, or undermining democratic norms without fully dismantling democracy. The distinction highlights a spectrum from warning signs to total authoritarian rule.
- Jonathan Rauch is a journalist and author known for analyzing political and social issues with a focus on democracy and governance. Sam Harris is a neuroscientist and philosopher who often discusses politics, ethics, and religion from a rationalist perspective. In this discussion, Rauch provides detailed definitions and historical context, while Harris offers philosophical insights and emphasizes the implications for liberal democracy. Together, they combine empirical analysis with ethical evaluation to explore the political phenomena.
Counterarguments
- Patrimonialism and fascism are complex phenomena that can manifest in various forms, and it may be an oversimplification to categorize a political leader or administration strictly within these terms without considering the broader political context and historical precedents.
- The assertion that Trump's governance exemplifies patrimonialism could be challenged by arguing that his actions, while controversial, were within the scope of executive power and influenced by his business background rather than a deliberate attempt to treat the state as personal property.
- The claim that patrimonialism leads to corruption and institutional decay might be countered by pointing out that not all forms of centralized or personalized leadership result in negative outcomes, and some may argue that certain states have benefited from strong, centralized leadership.
- The idea that patrimonialism is not necessarily ideological could be contested by suggesting that personal rule often aligns with specific ideological goals, even if those goals are not as explicitly stated as in fascist regimes.
- The identification of 18 properties of fascism in the Trump administration could be criticized for potentially conflating aggressive political rhetoric and controversial policies with genuine fascist ideology, which traditionally includes a more coherent and extreme set of principles.
- The use of terms like "trolling" and "extreme insults" to describe the Trump administration's tactics could be seen as subjective and potentially biased interpretations of political communication styles that are not universally agreed upon as inherently fascist.
- The claim that the Trump administration glorified violence against peaceful protesters might be countered by arguing that the administration's stance was focused on law and order rather than promoting violence for its own sake.
- The assertion that the Trump administration attempted to delegitimize the 2020 election could be met with the counterargument that questioning election integrity, whether justified or not, is not exclusive to fascism and can occur in various political contexts.
- The argument that labeling Trump and his enablers as fascist has become unavoidable might be challenged by suggesting that such labeling is politically charged and may hinder constructive political discourse and the ability to address the underlying issues in a non-partisan manner.
- The suggestion that the term "fascism" is complex and not fully applicable to Trump's GOP could be supported by arguing that the use of such terminology requires careful historical and political analysis to avoid mischaracterization and to respect the gravity of the term as it relates to historical fascist regimes.
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Defining and Distinguishing Fascism vs. Patrimonialism
Jonathan Rauch and Sam Harris delve into the distinctions between fascism and patrimonialism, clarifying the nature, implications, and characteristics of each.
Patrimonialism: The State as Leader's Property, Prioritizing Loyalty Over Competence
Jonathan Rauch outlines patrimonialism as a system where the state functions as personal property and a family business for the leader. These leaders dismantle bureaucratic structures and replace rules with personal loyalists, leading to rampant corruption and incompetence. However, this practice is not necessarily ideological or expansionist and may solely relate to the leader's personal enrichment.
Patrimonialism Weakens Institutions, Replacing Them With Loyalists, Leading To Corruption and Incompetence, but It's Not Inherently Ideological or Aggressive
Sam Harris echoes Rauch's description, commenting on Trump’s apparent patrimonialist approach, seeing America and its institutions as extensions of his personal property for his advantage. Personal gain for Trump's family influenced policy decisions, such as tariffs. Rauch adds that patrimonialism contrasts sharply with bureaucracy by actively eroding government competence thr ...
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Defining and Distinguishing Fascism vs. Patrimonialism
Additional Materials
Clarifications
- Patrimonialism is a form of governance where political authority is treated as personal property by the ruler. Historically, it was common in pre-modern states where rulers governed through personal relationships rather than formal institutions. It contrasts with modern bureaucratic states that rely on impersonal rules and merit-based administration. This concept helps explain how some leaders prioritize loyalty and family ties over institutional integrity.
- Bureaucratic structures are organized systems of rules and procedures that ensure government functions are carried out efficiently and fairly. They rely on trained experts and standardized processes rather than personal loyalty. Dismantling these structures removes checks and balances, leading to arbitrary decisions and reduced government effectiveness. This often results in corruption and incompetence as positions are filled based on loyalty, not merit.
- Bureaucracy is a system of government where decisions are made by appointed officials based on established rules and procedures. It emphasizes merit, expertise, and impartiality to ensure consistent and efficient administration. Patrimonialism replaces these rules with personal loyalty to the leader, prioritizing favoritism over competence. This leads to weakened institutions and increased corruption.
- "Ultranationalist" refers to an extreme form of nationalism that places the interests of one nation above all others, often promoting superiority and exclusion of other groups. It typically involves intense loyalty to the nation, aggressive policies, and intolerance toward minorities or foreign influences. This mindset can lead to xenophobia, discrimination, and justification for authoritarian rule. Ultranationalism often fuels conflict and suppresses dissent within the society.
- "National rebirth" in fascism refers to the idea that the nation has declined or become weak and must be restored to former glory. It often involves rejecting current political systems and cultural values seen as corrupt or decadent. This rebirth is framed as a collective revival of strength, unity, and purity. Fascist leaders use this concept to mobilize support by promising to rebuild the nation’s power and identity.
- Rejecting pluralism means refusing to accept diverse political opinions and groups within society. It leads to the suppression of dissent and the elimination of competing voices. This creates a uniform, controlled political environment dominated by a single ideology. Such rejection often results in authoritarian rule and limits democratic freedoms.
- Fascism opposes liberalism because it rejects individual rights and democratic pluralism. It favors a strong, centralized state led by a single party or leader. Fascism promotes unity through nationalism and often suppresses dissent. This contrasts with liberalism’s emphasis on freedom, equality, and political diversity.
- Fascist regimes often use violence as a tool to suppress opposition and assert dominanc ...
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Evaluating the Trump Administration Through Fascism
Jonathan Rauch has expressed his growing concern about the Trump administration exhibiting many properties traditionally associated with fascism.
The Trump Administration Exhibited Fascist Traits Such As Eroding Democratic Norms, Glorifying Violence, and Delegitimizing Elections
Rauch has identified 18 properties commonly tied to fascism, leading him to label the administration's actions and rhetoric as such.
Trump's Rhetoric and Actions Create Arena Where Traditional Liberal Discourse CanNot Compete
Rauch pointed out that the Trump campaign began with strategies like trolling, extreme insults, and derogatory comments. These tactics are characteristic of fascist movements that aim to undermine civil discourse. Liberals and those trained to embrace civil and tolerant discussions are often left unable to function effectively within this kind of environment shaped by fascist-style rhetoric. Fascists seek to create a space where their manner of discourse rules, rendering others speechless and overshadowed, which reflects an idea from Hitler’s "Mein Kampf" to dominate public consciousness regardless of ridicule.
Administration's Rhetoric and Actions Glorified Violence Against Citizens Exercising Constitutional Rights, as Seen In the Response To Amir Locke's Killing
Rauch sharply contrasts the ideal reluctance of governments in liberal democracies to resort to violence, with a tendency to de-escalate, to the glamorization of violence by the Trump administration. He describes a scenario where peaceful protesters are met with overpowering force, pinned to the ground, and shot by federal agents. These actions break with the tradition of a government that exercises restraint, and instead, protesters end up being labeled as ...
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Evaluating the Trump Administration Through Fascism
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Counterarguments
- The use of terms like "fascism" can be seen as hyperbolic and may not accurately reflect the complexity of the Trump administration's policies and actions.
- Some argue that the Trump administration's actions, while controversial, were within the bounds of the U.S. political system and do not constitute a break from democratic norms to the extent of fascism.
- The labeling of protesters as terrorists or insurrectionists may be seen by some as a response to specific instances of violence or rioting rather than a general stance against peaceful protest.
- Claims of election fraud, while widely discredited, are not unique to the Trump administration and have been a part of American political discourse in various forms throughout history.
- The assertion that the Trump administration glorified violence could be contested by pointing out instances where the administration condemned violence and called for law and order.
- Some may argue that the administration's rhetoric and actions were often taken out of context or misinterpreted by critics.
- The comparison to historical fascist movements may be considered an oversimplification that does not take into account the unique political and social context of contemporary America.
- It could be argued that the Trump administration's p ...
Actionables
- You can foster critical thinking by starting a "Fact-Check Friday" with friends or family where you collectively review political claims made during the week. This encourages a habit of questioning information and understanding the importance of verifying facts, which combats the spread of misinformation and the undermining of democratic processes.
- Encourage respectful discourse by creating a personal rule to never engage in name-calling or derogatory comments online. Instead, focus on constructive criticism and evidence-based arguments. This small change in behavior contributes to a healthier public conversation and pushes back against the normalization of aggressive rhe ...
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Dangers Of Labeling Current Politics As "Fascist"
The political climate is ripe with conversations that use strong labels to describe leaders and policies, among which "fascist" is a particularly controversial term.
Labeling Trump Administration "Fascist" May Alienate Audiences and Be Dismissed As Partisan
Rauch and Harris explore the implications of labeling the politics of the Trump administration as "fascist." They acknowledge that while there are differences between leaders who have fascist tendencies and those who administer full-fledged fascist regimes with complete control, terms like “fascist” can still be a lightning rod for controversy.
Administration's Severity and Fascist Shift Threaten Liberal Democracy
Harris takes the position that, despite possible pushback, calling Trump and his enablers fascist has become unavoidable. He believes that actions taken by the administration carry traits routinely associated with fascism, and these actions present very real threats to the foundations of liberal democracy. While it is not specified, the tone of their discussion suggests there is perceived severity in the administration's shift toward policies and behaviors aligned with fascist ideologies.
Using "Fascist" for Trump's Gop Reflects Its Trajectory, Despite Not Bein ...
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Dangers Of Labeling Current Politics As "Fascist"
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Counterarguments
- The term "fascist" is historically and academically specific, and its use should be reserved for regimes that meet the strict criteria of fascism, which includes elements like a totalitarian one-party state, suppression of opposition, and an economy controlled by the state in partnership with corporations.
- Labeling political opponents as "fascist" without clear evidence can dilute the meaning of the term and diminish the historical significance of actual fascist regimes.
- The use of "fascist" as a descriptor may be seen as hyperbolic and could undermine legitimate criticism of policies and actions by framing them in an extreme light that may not be accurate.
- Accusations of fascism may oversimplify complex political situations and ignore the nuances of policy-making and governance in a democratic context.
- The term "fascist" can be used as a rhetorical device to stifle debate and dismiss opposing viewpoints without engaging with the substance of the arguments.
- It is possible to oppose and critique the actions and policies of a political administration without resorting to labels that carry heavy historical and emotional weight.
- Some may argue that the use of "fascist" to describe the trajectory of a political party could be seen as fear-mongering and ma ...
Actionables
- You can foster nuanced political discussions by avoiding extreme labels and instead using specific examples of actions and policies that concern you. When talking with friends or on social media, focus on particular decisions or policies that you find problematic, and explain why they are concerning without resorting to labels. For instance, if you're worried about voter suppression tactics, discuss the specific laws or measures being enacted and their potential impact on democratic processes.
- Enhance your understanding of political systems by reading about the characteristics of different regimes, including fascist ones, from diverse sources. This will help you form a more informed opinion on current political events. Start with a simple internet search for articles or books on political systems, and aim to read from a variety of perspectives to avoid echo chambers. For example, if you read an article arguing that a certain policy is a sign of fascism, look for another that explains it differently and compare the arguments.
- Encourage critical thinking in your community by starting a boo ...
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