Podcasts > Making Sense with Sam Harris > #452 — Is Wokeness Finally Dead?

#452 — Is Wokeness Finally Dead?

By Waking Up with Sam Harris

In this episode of Making Sense, John McWhorter examines the current state of "woke" ideology in academic institutions. While McWhorter observes that this ideology may be declining in broader society, he explains how it continues to influence academia and the arts, affecting everything from conference themes to hiring practices and even specific academic subjects like music theory.

McWhorter and Sam Harris explore how this ideology has become resistant to critique, particularly regarding issues of power differentials and "whiteness." They discuss the future of Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) initiatives in higher education, and consider how these practices might evolve rather than disappear. The conversation addresses the potential effects of these ideological developments on student education and institutional practices.

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#452 — Is Wokeness Finally Dead?

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#452 — Is Wokeness Finally Dead?

1-Page Summary

Persistence and Spread of "Woke" Ideology in Academia

In this podcast episode, John McWhorter examines the persistence of "woke" ideology in academia and its potential to endure despite signs of its peak passing.

Entrenched Ideology in Academic Settings

McWhorter argues that while "woke" ideology may be past its peak in general society, it remains deeply embedded in academia and the arts. He explains that academics and artists often see themselves as bearers of truth rather than opinion holders, making them resistant to critique. This ideology, according to McWhorter, now influences everything from conference themes to hiring decisions and even shapes how music theory is taught, citing the example of a black musicologist who argues that music theory itself is inherently racist.

The Challenge of Ideological Change

McWhorter points out that the ideology has become particularly resistant to reason, especially regarding issues of power differentials and "whiteness." He suggests that even if politically opposed, initiatives like Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) might not disappear but rather adapt and continue under different labels. The ideology's resistance to contrary evidence, McWhorter notes, makes it particularly challenging to address within influential institutions.

Impact on Higher Education

McWhorter and Harris discuss the concerning effects of this ideological entrenchment on higher education. They suggest that the current ideological climate could limit students' access to well-rounded, critical education by influencing hiring practices, curriculum design, and campus atmosphere. McWhorter expresses particular concern about DEI efforts, which he characterizes as repurposed forms of affirmative action, suggesting their deeply ingrained nature makes systemic change particularly challenging in higher education.

1-Page Summary

Additional Materials

Clarifications

  • "Woke" originally meant being alert to social injustices, especially racial discrimination. It emerged from African American Vernacular English and gained wider use during the 2010s. Over time, it expanded to include awareness of various social inequalities and progressive causes. Critics use "woke" pejoratively to describe what they see as excessive political correctness or ideological rigidity.
  • "Woke" ideology peaked in general society as public interest and media focus shifted away from it after intense debate and backlash. Academia remains a stronghold because its institutions prioritize long-term cultural and social theories, which align with "woke" principles. Academic careers and reputations often depend on adherence to prevailing ideological norms, reinforcing persistence. This creates an environment where change is slower and resistance to opposing views is stronger.
  • Academics and artists often base their work on research, theory, or creative expression, which they present as objective or authoritative knowledge. This can lead them to view their conclusions as definitive truths rather than subjective opinions. Their professional training emphasizes evidence and expertise, reinforcing confidence in their perspectives. As a result, they may resist challenges that frame their views as merely personal beliefs.
  • "Woke" ideology influences conference themes by prioritizing topics related to social justice, diversity, and systemic inequality. Hiring decisions may favor candidates who align with these values or contribute to diversity goals. Curriculum content can be shaped to emphasize perspectives on race, gender, and power structures, sometimes reinterpreting traditional subjects through these lenses. This approach aims to reflect and address historical and social inequities within academic disciplines.
  • The claim that music theory is inherently racist stems from critiques that traditional Western music theory centers European musical norms and excludes or devalues non-Western musical traditions. This perspective argues that the frameworks and standards used in music education reflect cultural biases linked to historical power imbalances. Critics suggest that these biases perpetuate a narrow view of what is considered "valid" or "correct" music. The debate is part of broader discussions on decolonizing curricula and recognizing diverse cultural contributions.
  • In this context, "power differentials" refer to the unequal distribution of social, economic, or political power among groups, often based on race, class, or gender. "Whiteness" is used to describe the social and cultural norms, privileges, and systemic advantages historically associated with white people. The ideology critiques how these power structures maintain inequality and influence institutions. It emphasizes examining and challenging these embedded systems to promote equity.
  • Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) initiatives are programs aimed at increasing representation and fairness for historically marginalized groups in workplaces and educational institutions. They focus on creating environments where diverse backgrounds are valued, barriers to opportunity are removed, and all individuals feel included. Affirmative action is a specific policy that uses proactive measures, like targeted recruitment or admissions preferences, to address past discrimination. DEI efforts often build on or expand these ideas by promoting broader cultural and structural changes beyond just numerical representation.
  • DEI (Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion) efforts aim to create fair opportunities for underrepresented groups, similar to affirmative action. Affirmative action specifically uses policies to increase representation of minorities in education and employment. DEI expands this by also focusing on creating inclusive environments and addressing systemic inequities beyond just numbers. McWhorter suggests DEI continues affirmative action’s goals but with broader, institutional approaches.
  • This ideology resists reason by framing its core beliefs as moral imperatives rather than debatable opinions, making disagreement seem unethical. It often uses emotional appeals and identity-based arguments that prioritize lived experience over empirical evidence. Challenges to the ideology are frequently dismissed as attempts to uphold systemic oppression, creating a social pressure to conform. This dynamic discourages open debate and reinforces group cohesion around shared beliefs.
  • The ideology can lead to a narrower curriculum focused on identity and social justice themes, potentially limiting exposure to diverse viewpoints. It may create an environment where students feel pressured to conform to prevailing beliefs, reducing open debate. Hiring practices influenced by this ideology might prioritize ideological alignment over academic merit. This atmosphere can cause self-censorship and hinder critical thinking development.

Counterarguments

  • The term "woke" is often used pejoratively and may not accurately reflect the complex and diverse views within academia and the arts.
  • Academics and artists may argue that their work is based on rigorous research and evidence, and that they are open to critique when it is constructive and evidence-based.
  • The influence of any ideology on academic disciplines can be seen as part of the natural evolution of scholarship, which often involves challenging and re-evaluating established norms.
  • The claim that music theory or any discipline is inherently racist may be an oversimplification; scholars might argue that it's important to examine historical biases in all fields without dismissing the fields entirely.
  • Resistance to reason and contrary evidence is not unique to any one ideology; all ideological groups can exhibit confirmation bias.
  • DEI initiatives can be seen as efforts to address historical and systemic inequalities, and their adaptation over time may reflect a responsive and evolving approach to social justice.
  • The presence of a particular ideology in academia does not necessarily limit students' access to a well-rounded education; it could also be argued that exposure to diverse perspectives is a critical component of education.
  • Hiring practices and curriculum design influenced by considerations of diversity and equity can be seen as efforts to create a more inclusive and representative academic environment.
  • DEI efforts may be viewed as necessary steps towards creating a more equitable society, rather than simply repurposed affirmative action.
  • Systemic change in higher education, while challenging, can also be seen as an opportunity for growth and improvement in the quality of education.

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#452 — Is Wokeness Finally Dead?

Persistence and Spread of "Woke" Ideology in Academia

John McWhorter delves into the entrenched position of "woke" ideology in academia and its potential to persist even as some believe its peak has passed.

Entrenched Woke Ideology in Academic and Professional Domains

McWhorter asserts that the peak of "woke" ideology has passed but its influence on academia and the arts may be too deeply ingrained to be easily removed. As these fields were significant birthplaces of the ideology, it has become a hard-to-uproot part of their culture.

Ideology Is Ingrained In Academia, Journalism, and Arts, Making It Hard to Uproot

He describes academics, certain journalists, and artists as seeing themselves as vanguards of truths, not merely holders of individual opinions. They don’t recognize themselves when their ideology is critiqued. McWhorter calls attention to the authority these individuals hold, particularly in academia, where they shape the next generation of scholars – provided those graduate students are not white men.

He observes that "woke" ideology already influences conference themes, cocktail party conversations, hiring decisions, and the admissions process for students in academic programs, suggesting that reversing this ideological directionality in areas like hiring and program admissions would be notably challenging.

McWhorter points to a black musicologist, Philip Ewell, who holds the idea that music theory is inherently racist, as an example of the ideology affecting curricular decisions. McWhorter implies that such ideas, which he personally finds nonsensical, are nonetheless gaining traction.

Potential for Ideological Adaptation and Persistence Covertly

McWhorter raises concerns about an ideology that not only resists reason but also embraces a punitive stance against perceived societal ills, such as "whiteness." He observes that battling power differentials has become a central theme in ...

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Persistence and Spread of "Woke" Ideology in Academia

Additional Materials

Clarifications

  • "Woke" originally meant being alert to social injustices, especially racial discrimination. It emerged from African American Vernacular English and gained wider use during the 2010s. Over time, it came to describe a broader progressive awareness of inequality and systemic oppression. Critics use "woke" pejoratively to suggest excessive political correctness or ideological rigidity.
  • Academia, journalism, and the arts often explore social issues and cultural critiques, making them fertile ground for new ideologies. These fields attract thinkers who challenge traditional power structures and advocate for social justice. "Woke" ideology emerged from critical theories developed in universities and was amplified by media and artistic expression. Their influence shapes public discourse and cultural norms, embedding these ideas deeply.
  • The exclusion of white men from graduate programs is linked to efforts aimed at increasing diversity and addressing historical inequalities in academia. This practice is sometimes justified by the belief that white men have traditionally held disproportionate power and privilege. Critics argue it can lead to reverse discrimination and limit opportunities based on race and gender rather than merit. Supporters see it as a corrective measure to create a more equitable academic environment.
  • Philip Ewell is a music theorist and professor known for critiquing traditional Western music theory. He argues that the field often centers Eurocentric perspectives, marginalizing non-Western musical traditions. His claim is controversial because it challenges long-standing academic norms and suggests systemic bias in a technical discipline. Critics see this as politicizing music theory rather than focusing on its technical aspects.
  • "Whiteness" in this context refers to the social and cultural norms, privileges, and power structures historically associated with white people. It is analyzed as a system that perpetuates racial inequalities rather than just individual attitudes or behaviors. Critics argue that "whiteness" upholds systemic advantages that marginalize non-white groups. The ideology targets these structures to promote equity and challenge racial dominance.
  • Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) initiatives aim to create fair and welcoming environments by promoting representation and participation of historically marginalized groups. Diversity focuses on the presence of different identities, equity ensures fair treatment and access to opportunities, and inclusion fosters a sense of belonging for all individuals. These initiatives often involve policies, training, and programs to address systemic barriers and biases in workplaces, schools, and organizations. DEI efforts seek to improve social justice and organizational effectiveness by valuing varied perspectives and experiences.
  • Beliefs about black men and police violence are considered orthodoxy because numerous studies and high ...

Counterarguments

  • "Woke" ideology may not be as monolithic or as entrenched as suggested; there is diversity of thought within academia, journalism, and the arts, and many scholars and professionals actively engage in debates and critiques of these ideas.
  • The characterization of academics, journalists, and artists as unable to recognize critiques may overlook the nuanced discussions and self-critical approaches that exist within these fields.
  • The assertion that "woke" ideology excludes white men from graduate programs could be challenged by data showing that white men continue to be represented in many academic fields, and that diversity initiatives aim to address historical imbalances rather than exclude any particular group.
  • The influence of "woke" ideology on academic and professional practices could be seen as part of a broader and necessary evolution towards inclusivity and social justice, rather than a negative or reversible trend.
  • The claim that music theory is inherently racist, or other similar ideas, may have academic merit and could be part of a legitimate scholarly debate on how historical biases have shaped various disciplines.
  • The idea that the ideology resists reason and is punitive could be countered by arguing that it often seeks to highlight and address systemic injustices in a reasoned and constructive manner.
  • The notion that battl ...

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#452 — Is Wokeness Finally Dead?

The Challenges Of Addressing and Combating This Ideology

Shifting the Mindset Within Influential Institutions

McWhorter elucidates the difficulties in shifting perspectives within influential institutions due to entrenched ideologies that are resistant to evidence contradicting their established worldview.

Ideology in Power Resists Reason and Facts Challenging Worldview

McWhorter implies that addressing and combating the pervasive and resistant ideological beliefs poses a significant challenge. He illustrates how the ideology in power, which can dominate institutions like academia and the media, often struggles against facts that offer a conflicting narrative. He notes that this resistance to reason and evidence is not a one-time occurrence but rather a pattern that repeats itself, indicating a deeply rooted aversion to factual challenges.

McWhorter brings to attention the specific challenge of changing pervasive beliefs about issues such as police violence against black men. He references the case of Tony Timpa to underline the resistance to evidence within influential institutions. By pointing out such examples, he highlights just how deeply e ...

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The Challenges Of Addressing and Combating This Ideology

Additional Materials

Clarifications

  • John McWhorter is a linguist, author, and social commentator known for his critiques of contemporary social and racial issues. His perspective is significant because he combines academic expertise with accessible public commentary. He often challenges prevailing narratives in media and academia, sparking debate on race, culture, and ideology. His insights are valued for encouraging critical thinking about entrenched societal beliefs.
  • The specific ideology referred to is a set of beliefs that dominate certain institutions, often related to narratives about race and social justice. It includes perspectives that emphasize systemic racism and police violence against Black people. This ideology can resist contradictory evidence due to its deep integration in cultural and institutional frameworks. It is often discussed in debates about race, media representation, and academic discourse.
  • Tony Timpa was a man who died in 2016 after police restrained him for several minutes while he repeatedly said he could not breathe. The incident raised serious concerns about police use of force and accountability. His death was compared to other high-profile cases involving police and black men, highlighting systemic issues. The case exemplifies resistance within institutions to fully acknowledge or address such evidence.
  • "The allure of novelty" refers to the tendency for people to be attracted to new, trendy, or fashionable ideas, even if those ideas lack strong evidence. This attraction can make individuals more likely to adopt and defend fresh ideological perspectives without critical examination. In the context of ideological entrenchment, it means that new narratives can gain rapid acceptance and become deeply embedded, making it harder to challenge them with facts. This dynamic complicates efforts to change established beliefs because novelty can overshadow reasoned debate.
  • Academia and the media are singled out because they shape public opinion and knowledge on a large scale. These institutions often have established norms and dominant perspectives that influence what is studied, reported, and accepted as truth. Changing these norms threatens existing power structures and professional reput ...

Counterarguments

  • Ideologies may resist change not solely due to aversion to facts but also due to the complexity of issues and the difficulty in interpreting data in a way that is universally accepted.
  • Resistance to new evidence could be a sign of healthy skepticism in academia and media, which is essential for rigorous intellectual discourse and avoiding the adoption of unverified or misleading information.
  • The persistence of certain ideologies might be attributed to their foundational truths or ethical principles rather than a simple resistance to change or evidence.
  • The case of Tony Timpa and similar examples may not fully represent the broader context or may be exceptions rather than the rule, and thus may not be indicative of a systemic issue within institutions.
  • The notion that entrenched ideologies are resistant to change overlooks the historical evolution of thought within institutions, which have adapted and reformed over time in light of ne ...

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#452 — Is Wokeness Finally Dead?

Impact on Next Generation and Higher Education

The podcast discussion with McWhorter and Harris delves into the pressing concerns around ideology's influence on higher education, questioning the future of academia amidst these ideological pressures.

Concern Over Ideology's Impact on Youth Education and Development

Ideology's Impact on Hiring, Curriculum, and Campus Climate May Hinder Students' Access to a Well-Rounded, Critical Education

McWhorter points to the potential troubles with the current ideology's influence within academic settings. He suggests that this ideology's hold on aspects such as hiring, curriculum design, and the overall campus climate could limit students' ability to engage in critical thinking and cut off access to comprehensive education that offers multiple viewpoints.

Harris echoes the sentiment, sharing his discomfort with the persistent need to focus on race and "woke" ideology. He suggests that this could lead to an opportunity cost, with other valuable discussions and educational content being sidelined.

Higher Education's Future Uncertain Amid Ideological Pressures

Ideology's Persistence and Adaptability Cast Doubts on Remodeling Education System

McWhorter addresses the grim outlook for transformative change in the structural approach to Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) within higher education. He suggests that DEI efforts are often repurposed forms of affirmative action and racial preferences, and these ingrained ideologies may prove challenging to overhaul or oppose.

As Harris projects hopefulness for change, he simultaneous ...

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Impact on Next Generation and Higher Education

Additional Materials

Clarifications

  • The "ideology" refers primarily to progressive or "woke" social and cultural beliefs emphasizing race, identity, and social justice issues. It often promotes policies like affirmative action and diversity initiatives aimed at addressing historical inequalities. Critics argue it can prioritize certain perspectives, potentially limiting open debate and critical thinking. Supporters see it as essential for creating inclusive and equitable educational environments.
  • "Woke" ideology refers to a heightened awareness of social injustices, especially related to race, gender, and inequality. It is controversial because critics argue it can lead to excessive political correctness, censorship, or divisiveness. Supporters see it as necessary for addressing systemic discrimination and promoting equity. The debate centers on balancing social justice with free expression and diverse viewpoints.
  • Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) initiatives in higher education aim to create a campus environment where people of all backgrounds feel represented, respected, and supported. These programs often involve policies and practices to increase the enrollment and hiring of underrepresented groups. DEI efforts also include training and curriculum changes to address systemic biases and promote cultural awareness. Critics argue that some DEI approaches may prioritize identity over merit or limit open debate.
  • DEI (Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion) efforts aim to create fair opportunities for underrepresented groups in education and workplaces. Affirmative action policies specifically focus on increasing representation of racial minorities by considering race in hiring or admissions decisions. Both DEI and affirmative action seek to address historical inequalities but differ in scope and methods. Critics argue DEI can sometimes replicate affirmative action's focus on race, leading to similar debates about fairness and preference.
  • Opportunity cost in education means that focusing time and resources on one topic or ideology reduces the chance to explore other subjects. When certain themes dominate, other valuable ideas or discussions may be neglected or excluded. This trade-off can limit students' exposure to diverse perspectives and knowledge. It highlights the cost of prioritizing some content over others in the curriculum.
  • Ideology influences hiring by prioritizing candidates whose beliefs align with prevailing campus values, affecting diversity of thought. Curriculum design may reflect dominant ideological perspectives, shaping which topics are taught and how. Campus climate is shaped by policies and social norms that promote certain v ...

Counterarguments

  • Ideology is inherent in all forms of education, and the current focus on DEI may be a necessary correction to historical biases and underrepresentation in academia.
  • A well-rounded education includes understanding and engaging with contemporary social issues, which may necessitate a focus on race and "woke" ideology.
  • DEI initiatives can enhance critical thinking by exposing students to a wider range of perspectives and experiences, which may have been previously marginalized.
  • The adaptability of ideologies within higher education can be seen as a strength, allowing institutions to evolve and stay relevant to current societal issues.
  • The challenges in remodeling the higher education system may not necessarily be due to the persistence of ideologies but could be attributed to the complexity of educational institutions and the need for systemic change.
  • ...

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