The Dark Side of Internet Fame w/ Marcus King | 2 Bears, 1 Cave
In this episode of 2 Bears, 1 Cave, Marcus King joins Bert Kreischer to discuss the challenges of creating authentic art in the digital age. The conversation explores how musicians and comedians navigate artistic expression without being confined by genre labels, while examining the impact of platforms like TikTok on artist development and the creative process.
King and Kreischer share their experiences with mental health, addiction, and maintaining authenticity in the public eye. They discuss how social media affects artists' well-being, the role of negative comments in triggering self-doubt, and the importance of genuine connection with audiences. The conversation includes King's journey with alcoholism and its effect on his music, as well as Kreischer's own experiences with substance use and lifestyle changes.
This is a preview of the Shortform summary of the Dec 1, 2025 episode of the 2 Bears, 1 Cave with Tom Segura & Bert Kreischer
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1-Page Summary
Music and Artistic Expression
In a discussion between Marcus King and Bert Kreischer, they explore how musicians and comedians create authentic art without being confined by traditional boundaries. Marcus King suggests that the best Southern rock bands aren't limited by genre labels but are simply rock and roll bands from the South. Both artists emphasize the importance of following intuitive creative processes rather than conforming to specific categories.
King expresses concern about artists gaining instant fame through platforms like TikTok without developing their craft through traditional live performances. He also highlights the significance of recording environments, particularly praising Capricorn Studios in Macon, Georgia, for its historic importance and ability to bring out authentic performances.
Impact of Social Media on Artists
The conversation turns to social media's effect on artists' well-being. King reveals how negative comments can trigger self-doubt, particularly when they target his personal life. Bert Kreischer shares his strategy of avoiding comments altogether, though he acknowledges their lasting impact.
Both artists discuss the challenge of maintaining authenticity while managing public personas. Kreischer notes the difficulty of forming genuine connections with established artists, while King praises performers like Lainey Wilson and Jamie Johnson who maintain consistency both on and off stage.
Struggles With Mental Health, Addiction, and Authenticity
Marcus King openly discusses his battle with alcoholism, describing how it affected both his creative process and personal life. He shares his experience recording an album partly while drinking heavily and partly while sober, noting the clear differences in the output. Kreischer contributes his own experiences with substance use and weight management, including his use of Monjaro and its impact on his lifestyle.
Importance of Vulnerability and Honesty in Work
Both artists emphasize the value of genuine expression in their work. King discusses how music became a vessel for feeling loved despite his struggles with self-worth, while Kreischer describes being moved to tears by King's music, particularly songs like "Dirt" and "On and On." They agree that creating an intimate connection with audiences is crucial, with Kreischer noting how his storytelling feels as personal as sharing stories in his living room.
1-Page Summary
Additional Materials
Counterarguments
- While intuitive creative processes are important, some artists may find that adhering to certain genre boundaries or categories can provide a useful structure for their creativity and help them reach specific audiences.
- The distinction between Southern rock bands and other rock bands can be significant to fans and musicians who take pride in the cultural and regional influences that shape their music.
- Platforms like TikTok can offer valuable exposure for emerging artists and can be a modern extension of traditional live performances, adapting to the digital age.
- While historic recording environments like Capricorn Studios are revered, modern technology allows for high-quality recording in various environments, which can also lead to authentic performances.
- Engaging with social media comments can sometimes provide valuable feedback for artists and help them connect with their audience, even if some comments are negative.
- Public personas can be an important part of an artist's brand and career, and managing them effectively does not necessarily mean a loss of authenticity.
- Substance use and personal struggles can sometimes contribute to an artist's creative process in complex ways that are not entirely negative, although this is not an endorsement of such behaviors.
- Vulnerability and honesty in art are important, but there can also be a place for art that is escapist, fantastical, or adopts a persona, which can be equally valid forms of expression.
- Emotional responses to art are subjective, and not all genuine expressions will resonate with every audience member in the same way.
Actionables
- You can explore your own creativity by setting aside time each week to create something without any predefined rules or expectations. For instance, if you enjoy writing, try composing a short story without worrying about genre or traditional narrative structure. This can help you tap into your intuition and may lead to more authentic creative work.
- Start a personal project where you document your life or a particular aspect of it through art, like photography or painting, focusing on capturing moments that feel true to you rather than seeking external validation. This could be a daily photo of something that resonates with you, or a painting that reflects your mood or thoughts, helping you to value the process over the outcome and to stay grounded in your personal experience.
- Create a playlist of music that has moved you to tears or evoked a strong emotional response, and share it with friends or family. Discuss with them why these pieces are powerful to you, and encourage them to do the same. This exchange can deepen your understanding of the emotional impact of music and foster genuine connections through shared vulnerability.
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Music and Artistic Expression
In a poignant discussion about music and creativity, Marcus King and Bert Kreischer delve into the nuances of how musicians and comedians create authentic art without being bound by traditional confines.
Musicians Craft Authentic Expressions That Transcend Genres
Bert and Marcus On Avoiding Musical Confines For an Intuitive Creative Process
Marcus King states that the best Southern rock bands aren't confined by the genre label of "Southern rock" but are rock and roll bands from the South, implying an authentic, genre-transcending approach to music. He believes that embracing an intuitive process "adds a little extra gravy" to their music, harmonizing well with the genre. Similarly, Bert admits that he doesn't do traditional stand-up and doesn't know exactly what his stage performance entails, but like Marcus, he focuses on making his own impact in history, not worrying about fitting into a specific category. An example Marcus gives is playing jazz fusion in cowboy hats, indicating a disregard for genre labels in favor of what feels right.
Artists Gaining Fame Through Unconventional Means May Face Challenges In Being Taken Seriously
Marcus Frustrated by Tiktok Fame Without Artistic Development
Marcus King expresses frustration with artists who suddenly gain fame, such as bluegrass artists behaving like rockstars after the genre's rise in popularity, or TikTok creators who achieve notoriety from home without the traditional grind of live performances. Marcus contrasts this with the years of effort others spend playing small gigs on inconvenient nights, suggesting a disparity in the authenticity and development of artistry. He jokes about creating a TikTok album under a pseudonym, poking fun at how easily certain content can go viral on the platform.
Studio Choice and Recording Process Impact Final Product
Marcus on Engineer and S ...
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Music and Artistic Expression
Additional Materials
Counterarguments
- While transcending genres can lead to authentic art, some artists may find that adhering to a specific genre provides a sense of identity and community that can also foster creativity and connection with their audience.
- The label "Southern rock" might carry cultural and musical significance that is important to both artists and fans, and embracing this label can be a source of pride and authenticity for some bands.
- Fitting into specific categories or genres can help new artists find their audience and provide a framework for them to develop their style before potentially branching out.
- Blending styles and appearances can sometimes be perceived as inauthentic or gimmicky if not done with genuine artistic intent.
- Rapid fame through platforms like TikTok can democratize the music industry, allowing artists who might not have traditional access to the music scene to share their work and find an audience.
- The traditional grind of live gigs is not the only way to develop as an artist; some may argue that the internet and digital platforms offer new, valid forms of artistic growth and development.
- While historic studios may contribute to the depth and integrity of music, modern technology allows for high-quality recording in various environments, and some artists may find that re ...
Actionables
- You can explore your own creativity by starting a genre-blending music diary. Use a simple app like GarageBand or an online music platform to record short, daily snippets of music that combine different genres you enjoy. For example, mix a classical piano melody with a hip-hop beat, or overlay a country guitar riff onto an electronic track. This practice encourages you to break away from genre constraints and develop a more intuitive creative process.
- Organize a local 'studio crawl' to connect with the history of music in your area. Research recording studios or historic music venues nearby and arrange visits or tours to soak in the atmosphere. While there, take notes or record voice memos about how the environment makes you feel and how it might influence your creative expression. This can deepen your appreciation for the spaces that shape music and inspire you to seek out environments that enhance your own authenticity.
- Create a 'vulnerability playlist' to understand the impact of ...
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Impact of Social Media on Artists
Bert Kreischer and Marcus King discuss the profound impact that social media can have on artists, from damaging self-confidence to complicating the maintenance of an authentic persona.
Negative Comments and Criticism Can Damage Artists' Self-Confidence
Both Kreischer and King share personal experiences with harsh comments on social media. Marcus King reveals that negative comments can lead to a cycle of self-doubt and diminished self-confidence. He confesses that reading detrimental posts online impacts him, particularly mean remarks about his relationship with his wife.
Bert Kreischer chooses not to read the comments as a way to shield himself from negativity. Despite this approach, he admits that mean comments, even those intended to be humorous, can still affect artists. For instance, Kreischer recalls a specific critique about his performance, merely reducing it to him taking his shirt off, getting drunk, and telling a single story. Such critiques have left lasting impressions on him.
Anonymity Online Allows Harsh Criticisms Without Accountability
King points out that negative comments often come from individuals posting anonymously or using ghost accounts. He notes that people like an attorney for UMG can hide behind the shield of anonymity, making spiteful remarks without any public backlash.
When King personally addresses negative commenters to remind them of their impact, they rarely respond, suggesting that they wouldn’t make such comments directly to an artist's face. This phenomenon underscores a disconnect between the human and the artist's public persona that social media exacerbates.
Artist's Persona May Diverge From the Human
Kreischer and King highlight how the artist's persona can differ greatly from the individual behind it. Kreischer talks about being seen as constantly drunk on stage, which is a misleading assumption built into his public image. King notes that the public often dehumanizes artists by considering them more as brands than as people, making it challenging to maintain authenticity.
Bert finds it difficult to establish genuine connections with artists like Zac Brown who were already well-known when he met them, unlike his friendships with Marcus King and Jelly, which developed before they gained sign ...
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Impact of Social Media on Artists
Additional Materials
Clarifications
- Bert Kreischer is a comedian known for his storytelling and energetic stage presence. Marcus King is a blues-rock musician recognized for his guitar skills and soulful voice. Both have public careers that involve frequent interaction with fans and critics on social media. Their experiences provide insight into how online feedback affects artists' mental health and public image.
- UMG stands for Universal Music Group, one of the largest music corporations globally. An attorney from UMG being mentioned highlights that even professionals connected to major industry players can hide behind anonymity online. This underscores how social media allows people, regardless of status, to make harsh comments without accountability. It illustrates the broader issue of online criticism affecting artists from all levels of the music industry.
- Bert Kreischer is a comedian known for his energetic and often wild stage presence. His persona includes stories about partying, drinking, and humorous antics, which often involve him taking his shirt off. This image stems from his famous "The Machine" story, where he recounts a drunken adventure in Russia. The shirtless, party-loving character has become a recognizable part of his comedy brand.
- Zac Brown is a well-known country music singer and leader of the Zac Brown Band. Nate Bargatze is a popular stand-up comedian recognized for his relatable humor. Justin Timberlake is a globally famous pop singer and actor, formerly part of *NSYNC. Lainey Wilson and Jamie Johnson are country music artists noted for their authentic styles. Shane Gillis is a comedian known for his candid and straightforward comedic approach.
- Ghost accounts are fake or anonymous social media profiles created to hide the user's real identity. They allow people to post comments or messages without revealing who they are. This anonymity can encourage harsher or more negative behavior since users feel less accountable. Ghost accounts are often used to avoid personal consequences for online actions.
- Justin Timberlake is a globally famous musician and actor known for his high level of success and influence. Nate Bargatze's advice likely reflects Timberlake's established status, suggesting he may have limited time or interest in forming new personal connections. This highlights the challenges of building relationships with highly successful celebrities. It also implies that such figures often pr ...
Counterarguments
- Social media also offers a platform for artists to connect directly with their audience, which can be empowering and provide a supportive community.
- Constructive criticism on social media can be beneficial for artists' growth and improvement in their craft.
- Some artists may use negative comments as motivation to improve or as a way to engage with their audience and address misconceptions.
- The ability to manage and filter feedback is a skill that can be developed, and some artists might excel at using criticism to their advantage without it affecting their self-confidence.
- Anonymity online can also protect individuals who wish to express their opinions freely without fear of personal repercussions, which can be important for honest feedback.
- The divergence between an artist's persona and their true self can sometimes be a conscious artistic choice or a form of self-expression rather than a complication.
- Fame inherently changes social dynamics, and it's natural for well-known artists to be selective about new acquaintances to maintain privacy and manage their time effectively.
- Authenticity is subjective, and what is perceived as genuine by one person might be seen as a persona by another; the line between authenticity and performance ...
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Struggles With Mental Health, Addiction, and Authenticity
Marcus King and Bert Kreischer delve into their personal lives, discussing the delicate balance between creative expression, substance abuse, and the quest for genuine connection.
Substance Abuse Impacts Artist's Creativity and Life
Marcus Discusses Alcoholism's Impact on His Music, Relationships, and Self-Worth
Marcus King reflects on his struggles with alcohol, indicating that for him, being drunk facilitated a cathartic experience, allowing for deep and necessary conversations. However, he notes that it also brings out a destructive side in him, leading to feelings of unworthiness and a tendency to sabotage the good in his life. He acknowledges this destructive pattern and his commitment not to indulge in alcohol despite its impact on his interactions with others.
While working on his album, King observed the effect of his substance use on his creative process. He recorded half of the album while drinking heavily and the other half while sober and microdosing. He can tell the difference between the parts of the album influenced by substances and those produced while sober.
King also admits to using cocaine and enjoying it until the risk of [restricted term] contamination made him quit. His decision was further solidified by his desire to live for his wife, whom he had met at the time.
Balancing Professional Success and Personal Well-Being
Bert and Marcus on Mental Health and Habits in High-Profile Careers
Both Bert Kreischer and Marcus King share personal stories indicating the challenges of managing substance use and prioritizing mental health while navigating high-profile careers. Kreischer speaks about inspiring someone to seek medical help through his own weight loss efforts and how his experience with a medication, Monjaro, helped him curb his drinking at the cost of losing the 'sparkle' of enjoyment in life.
Kreischer also recounts his past use of [restricted term], liking the process of taking it, which resembled drinking or cocaine use, before stopping on his cardiologist's advice. King, on his part, admits to waking up with the urg ...
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Struggles With Mental Health, Addiction, and Authenticity
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Actionables
- You can start a journal to document your emotional state and triggers when you feel the urge to engage in unhealthy habits, helping you identify patterns and develop coping strategies. For example, if you notice you're reaching for a drink after a stressful day at work, you might instead schedule a workout session or a call with a supportive friend during that time to distract and calm yourself.
- Create a playlist of songs that resonate with your personal struggles and triumphs, using music as a therapeutic tool to process emotions. When feeling undeserving of love or battling urges, listening to this personalized playlist can offer comfort and a sense of connection, much like how some artists use music to express their vulnerabilities.
- Engage in a creat ...
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Importance of Vulnerability and Honesty in Work
Bert Kreischer and Marcus King delve into the power of raw emotion and real experiences, discussing the value of genuine expression in art and its connection to authenticity and vulnerability.
Bert and Marcus Value Art From Authentic Expression
Meaningful Creative Endeavors Reveal True Vulnerability and Transparency About Lived Experiences
Bert Kreischer and Marcus King emphasize the authenticity in art, admiring acts that showcase an individual's true self, similar to Morgan Wallen's action of throwing a chair off a roof. Marcus King, reflecting on his emotional experience with Corey Henry, suggests that a sense of vulnerability and personal connection to music and people enhances collaboration.
Marcus King values the raw honesty derived from deep, inebriated conversations, proposing that such states can lead to more meaningful exchanges. His own album lyrics, which address his battle with addiction, symbolize the heavier struggles with substances. He lays bare his feelings of unworthiness and admits to chasing them down with therapy, demonstrating a transparency about his efforts to understand and better himself.
Bert Kreischer expresses a deep emotional connection to King's music, similar to his feelings about artist Shannon Hoon. King's songs "Dirt" and "On and On" touch Kreischer profoundly, making him appreciate King's voice and its emotional impact.
Bert and Marcus Prioritize Audience Connection
Cultivating Intimacy and Relatability in Performances
Marcus King speaks of his authentic creative process, noting his choice to record songs in a studio and release them "like an adult" instead of simply posting them on TikTok. This approach underscores his commitment to genuine artistic development. Both Kreischer and King discuss the idea of separating personal identity from public persona, using a false name to release music. Still, Kreischer lauds King for living openly, sharing all aspects of his life through music—scars, pain, joys, fears, and love.
Kreischer comments on his own storytelling, which someone noticed feels as intimate as if he's sharing stories in his living room, indicating a desire to create a close connection with his audience. Marcus agrees, adding that such a comforting and welcoming atmosphere makes people feel at home.
Sharing Personal Struggles Can Inspire and Strengthen Fans
Bert and Marcus Share Their Mental Health, Addiction, and Self-Doubt Journeys to Comfort and Encourage Others Facing Similar Challenges
Kreischer and King candidly discus ...
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Importance of Vulnerability and Honesty in Work
Additional Materials
Clarifications
- Bert Kreischer is a comedian known for storytelling and podcasting, often sharing personal experiences. Marcus King is a musician and singer-songwriter recognized for his soulful blues and rock music. They discuss art and vulnerability because both use personal honesty in their creative work to connect deeply with audiences. Their conversation highlights how openness about struggles enhances authenticity in performance.
- Morgan Wallen's action of throwing a chair off a roof symbolizes a raw, unfiltered expression of emotion, often seen as a rebellious or impulsive act. It represents breaking social norms to reveal genuine feelings, aligning with the idea of authenticity in art. This act is used metaphorically to highlight the value of showing true vulnerability rather than polished or controlled behavior. It underscores the importance of honesty and realness in creative expression.
- Marcus King is a blues-rock musician known for deeply personal songwriting. His album lyrics often explore themes of addiction, reflecting his real-life struggles with substance abuse. These songs reveal his emotional battles and efforts toward recovery, providing insight into his vulnerability. This candidness helps listeners connect with the raw honesty of his music.
- Shannon Hoon was the lead singer of the band Blind Melon, known for his emotive voice and raw, heartfelt lyrics. He struggled with addiction and died young, which adds a layer of poignancy to his music. Bert Kreischer’s comparison suggests that King’s music evokes a similar deep emotional impact and authenticity. This connection highlights the power of vulnerability in art to resonate profoundly with listeners.
- Recording songs "like an adult" means taking time to professionally produce and refine music in a studio, focusing on quality and artistic integrity. Posting on TikTok often involves sharing quick, informal clips that prioritize viral potential over polished production. The implication is that studio recording reflects a serious, deliberate approach to music creation, while TikTok can be seen as more casual and trend-driven. This distinction highlights a commitment to long-term artistic development rather than immediate social media attention.
- Artists use false names, or pseudonyms, to separate their personal identity from their public work, allowing privacy and creative freedom. This can help them explore different styles or themes without affecting their main reputation. It also protects them from public scrutiny or judgment tied to their real name. Additionally, pseudonyms can create a distinct artistic persona that resonates differently with audiences.
- Theo Vaughn is a comedian and actor known for his candid and humorous storytelling. He has publicly discussed his struggles with substance abuse, making him relevant to conversations about vulnerability and addiction. His openness about ...
Counterarguments
- Authenticity in art is subjective, and what feels genuine to one person may not resonate with another.
- The connection between vulnerability in art and its quality is not always direct; some art may be compelling without the artist's personal vulnerability.
- Deep, inebriated conversations may not always lead to meaningful exchanges; sometimes they can result in miscommunication or regrettable interactions.
- Professional recording is not the only valid form of artistic development; many artists find success and authenticity through social media platforms like TikTok.
- Using a false name to release music could be seen as a lack of authenticity or a way to avoid accountability.
- Sharing personal struggles in a public forum can be therapeutic and inspiring, but it can also lead to oversharing or exploitation of one's own emotional experiences.
- The idea that artists should openly share their personal lives can put undue pressure on individuals who value privacy.
- While openness about personal problems can foster connection, it can also inadvertently glamorize those issues or overshadow the art itself.
- Relatability ...
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